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our continuing coverage of the boston terrorist attack continues next with neil cavuto. ♪ >> that the intent of whoever orchestrated these attacks in boston was too jarred the markets are economically, at least on that front they have not succeeded. in early reid from the futures markets and from trading abroad is that we were shaken but not sturdy enough to get out of town. wait too early but this much we can say, what happened in boston got us but not as of yet stopped us. so now the latest from peter
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barnes how nervous washington is responding and the white house is acting. >> the president said he has directed the full resources of the federal government to help protect people people, increased security as necessary and help to find out what happened in boston. he spent the day talking to the national security team to get more information and also briefed members of congress and promised whoever did this will be found and held accountable. >> we still do not know who did this or why. and people should not jump to conclusions before we have all the facts. but make no mistake, we will get to the bottom of this and find out who did this, why they did this. any responsible individuals individuals, responsible groups will feel the full weight of justice.
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>> in his statement in the briefing room he did not use the word terror but 20 years -- 20 minutes later they said obviously with this many explosions with an instance like this it is an act of terror and will be dealt with as an act of terror. neil: h also marshalled the justice department to offer massachusetts whatever help it needs and however many people it needs. but to get them involved in an wait a half an hour from now to wait for the fbi to be among the participants to give us the latest of what happened, what is going o >> the fbi is sending additional agents to boston and the u.s. attorney's office is trying to
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coordinate the response of the investigators and all of the other responders that the federal government can use. so we expect we'll get an update on that with the press conference in half an hour. neil: everyone is questioning of this is a terrorist attack. we think of al qaeda but of course, it is something that arises hand you were in boston today this did the trick. 120 injured. to dead. those numbers are far from final as the more severe injuries are spread out across the area. of hospital mekka some of the premier hospitals are within a 2-mile radius. with us now is former new jersey governor tom keane to is with us in the flash.
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so much we don't know. maybe someone who looks at communication among agencies during 9/11, what do you think of the communication between the respective agencies? >> so far it sounds pretty good. federal government working with local authorities authorities, working together, it seems to me in a seamless way they are trying to interviiw people but it is not the law enforcement authorities who catch people is somebody who's sees something and reports it. neil: there is a lot of cameras on every street corner. >> they will be lolooking at all the cameras, examining the exosive to find out what kind it was and where it might have come from.
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people interviewing people. if we find to it is my suspicion is because of the cameras and people. neil: what if it is home grown? >> that is always the big worry because we can stop people coming into the country. but if they are already here it is a great problem and i have done a report on that very subject with homegrown terrorists. it sounds like it might be in that category. we don't know anything gets but the terrorist from a terrorist network, somebody who has said genwich -- who has a grudge. there are a lot of violent people out there. neil: this patriot's day in massachusetts celebrates our
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independents, and our battles at lexington 1775. it could be conjecture is giving therefore the country then how together regard despite that this is not about republicans or democrats. it could get pretty hairy. >> it could. you're absolutely right. boston was the start of this country and is in the center of a memorial, patriotism, all of that to have patriot's day and do with the largest event with the boston marathon, somebody is aiming at something. we will find out what. neil: shaking the cobwebs off my head but sometimes we're lucky sometimes were not. 1993 we got lucky that the van was not parked 8 inches
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closer because the whole building would have clap -- collapsed. this case we could have been like the -- lucky despite the two fatalities that if it had gone off at a different time or earlier before many premier runners had come to the finish line. maybe this went off too late or did not have as mh bang as they wanted. >> if you're going to do this as they wanted at the time of the lead runners came to the finish line. >> there would have been a lot more people around that fish line so we presume
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they wanted to kill as many people as possible. >> what about that repeated nature of the jfk museum that it was confirmed by reuters there was an explosion there. others tested. a london feel and the madrid feel to this. >> i could be wrong but there would be a link it may turn out to be the lone wolf terrorist native-born is our biggest worry and this smells of that to me. native-born, someone who has a gdge, the white smoke indicates it was not plastic explosives but oldashioned if that is true it could be native-born and
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unfortunately has of greenwich the past to do with the city or the marathon. neil: governor thank you. now the latest from boston w. f. x. p reporter, reporter, crystal? >> right now boston is a ghost town. officials here have fast everyone to clear out and the 15 block area of the finish line has been shut down for at least 24 hours, maybe longer or less as we investigate. but the president of boston university wants to it is in critical condition as a result of these two bombings at the marathon. also the boston globe it is reportingf the two fatalities in a year-old
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little boy is one victim. so a sad day in boston. neil: thank you very much. a little boy? american home grown or not what are you thinking? former massachusetts senator scott brown is with us. governor cade was mentioning something interesting to be an issue of faulty timing it could have been worse had it gone off earlier when the premier runners were coming over the finish line that for a bigger body count than what we were seeing? >> i think it is speculation it is too early to make those assumptions but initially to be honest i was horrified when i was hearing not only from friends and co-workers know i am mad to
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think somebody would be so cowardly as they are right now to attack people those to fulfill a dream and have a good day there is some symbolism the marathon and the red sox playing and the population was up another one point* 5 million it was a rich target environment and fortunately we had this happen that the first responders were ready and the tents were there and we do have some of the best hospitals in the world and it could have been norse -- worse. neil: but what it does about shaking america is confidence i will say we had
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been immune but largely save since 9/11. of lot of close calls that we have dodged that while seeing madrid, london, but not here. does this get americans that it cast a pall over this country again? >> is certainly makes us more aware if you have to be diligent to your surroundings that is something is out of place reported you are wrong you are embarrassed but if you are right you save lives. we live in the greatest country of the world we are best when our back is against the wall i am most proud of our country right now. people working together in marathon runners running to the hospitals to give blood. that is the of country we live in so hopefully people
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will be more aware but hopefully they will get mad with this form of terrorism to get back with the drone strike that we will stand tall and continue on with our lives in the markets will be strong, go to work and hold our head high, talk about whatas happened and see what went wrong and right to make sure doesn't happen again. that is what we will do. neil: and i thank you are right. good reminders even under these situations. now to the senator's point* we are of business network after all not to be callous or indifferent but what is supposed to be a terrorist target when new target anything america you bring it to its knees. but whoever inspire them today it isn't working. most futures markets
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indicate that will likely change but it is a reflection if looking at the 9/11 to malts even when the markets were closed for four days then when they reopened they tumbled but this is on a day the overall market's tumble very badly especially when news of the attack hit. that was the moment that scott remembers well to witness today's attacks to join us on the phone. how are you doing? everyone okayed your family? >> i am with my fiaee. i want to say my prayers and thoughts go out to the families of the deceased and injured. neil: what did you see? >> i was around the corner.
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they had just finished and was on the 15th floor. my friend and his wife just was there for no more than five minutes when we heard this god-awful sound and we bo said what the hell was that? certainly something i had never heard and you hope to never have to hear again. then we heard the second a couple minutes later then we heard sirens and reduce something really bad. we could not see anything. maybe the reason we could not see the plume of smoke it may just have been the trajectory of the blast that you hear the doctors are pulling ball brings out of
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lower leg injuries. neil: i'm confused with the timing but just a little bit earlier when they were coming out of the finish line the crowd in the street would be much more crowded. was that the case? if so, then obviously the injuries or god forbid us could have been higher. >> i was listening to your former cast touched on the fact the winners had finished two hours prior. the majority of finishers especially in a marathon where you have to earn your way in through the qualification, for lot of the runners it is a celebration i made it to the
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show. i made it to boston. once they are here they don't take it that seriously in a competitive sense. so i cannot reach into the mind of a terrorist but maybe with maximum damage damage, four hours is likely the majority of what runners would make it to the finish line and given that there are friends and family most likely that is when you get the maxum amount of crowd. when i was just there 31 minutes before and obviously that area is so crowded. neil: i am glad you are all right and your fiancee is all right. what a scary day. thank you very much. neil: the situation to dead
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dead, 120 injured more serely injured are spread out across the top hospitals in the world from the greater boston area. hopefully they will be okay. also 13 minutes away from a press conference that will involve jus about every major security entity of the united states not all the including from bosses -- boston area but justice department at all. we know this seemed very well it is very good to have you. we had the co-chair of the 9/11 commission tom keane saying if it is the home grown terrorists like terry nichols makes things a little more problematic. >> it is so easy to get into speculation and if you
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remember afterklahoma city bombing they found out it was homegrown. neil: it doesn't make a difference why you target the person but for someone like you who tries to get inside the bad guy's head, what do try to find out? >> it is about bidding inside the head and motivation whether political or religious it is about solving the crime. neil: what do you look for? you get a degree in behavior ? >> with the interrogation that is one of the major components with this investigation witnesses interviewed sources and may be subjects. for the skilled interrogator that the joint terrorism task force have a great
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amount of skilled interrogators what makes the individuals stick and if they have suspects to disrupt anything else coming neil: we're getting word 134 injured on top of the two known dead 59 serious. but with a state holiday we do know that it was a marathon day and there are cameras on streetcorners. do you think the odds are good whoever perpetrated this attack is on some of the video of? >> the odds are very good. you have the crime scene forensics investigation going on right now with state and local. neil: what do they look for without giving away secrets?
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were they trying to piece together? >> from the components, the traces of what explosives were used, high explosives, a lesser grade explosives. neil: could you say a detonator like a cellphone but they did not stop also phone service makes me think that was not the issue. >> i so difficult to tell but i can guarantee the teams on the scene are well above and passed that. neil: we do know there will be a press conference soon with every agency represented. a lot of people behind this podium in boston. do they trip on themselves? to their risk repeating each other's investigative efforts? >> with governor kae the 9/11 report one of the outcomes of of the huge
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national tragedy from my experience even before the report, a state federal local much better, much better. absolutely. i would say there is an exceptional relationship going on right now with the accord nation from the u.s. attorney's office, fbi field , boston pd and also national. neil: we are the boss. we are the boss. who is the boss? >> with the law enforcement background of course, that can happen with the fbi, in cis, atf, local police but it is much better than years past. neil: at number five until you to your background i am the boss. >> and the reality is with a tragedy like this with the course of my 20 plus years
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is let's get this done. neil: i did not happen after 9/11 they read each other's throats. >> not from my experience. neil: good for you. bag gives me hope. but before i get to my next guest talk about the economic impact just like there was no accident that occurredn new york or in 1993 but the hope is you trigger not only as a cataclysmic event that the economic events that leads to recession or worse at was the hope to a small degree and to roberts' point* of what happens in our markets. we told you about the futures for the time came being and the first market that is trading is out of
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japan and the first numbers is that it is down by one and 2/3%. with that hit that built the steam in the last hour. it built up conserable steam after that. and we will be going to the pacific markets and to explain disappointment out of china not just trrorist related but we are getting a first reaction to developments in boston and the markets in asia. maureen joins us on the floor. how much do you think this
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will play out in the market? >> looking for a downturn that was the icing on the gate that as speed economic data has worsened it gives reason looking at gold this morning but did take those profits off the table thinking where we would re-enter the market. >>. neil: taking the crazy guy off the front page from north korea and replaced it with a terrorist threat whether domestic and it was
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the anxious one. >> and notice the markets turned heavily down toward the end of the day probably because of the boston marathon. but for all different reasons it only takes one or tutus set off a flight for people in the investing world. >> sometimes it just punctuates and my the united states had run up too far too fast. is this the incident forgotten with china's
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gross, you're falling apart piling on american icons like google. >> previous to this horrific act i think people were focusing on earnings and of those reporting this week i think we will have guidance that has been lower and anticipating the first quarter was not as good as the last quarter it was mewhat of a negative atmosphere bill than in prior to today anyway so we may see this until we clean it out but waiting for this to happen in the market so they could get back in.
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a and then looking at this action as a buying opportunity. may be of some point* in time we can turn something bad into something good. neil: i appreciate you taking the time. to continue our live coverage every security officials will be gathering behind the podium and i am betting once they talk an we will go live, that will conceivably lasted good long while every agency involved including the fbi fire officials and the massachusetts governor the of boston mayor, probably a senator or two or representatives or to. , and security to show a coordinated reaction and to
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understand why officials made the decision when they did including controversial not cutting off wireless communications altogether when it looks like there was a coordinated sulfone activated bomb attack going on. here with that is michael gray on the cellphone outages and if the government should have done more or did do more. >> hello. i have been watching this unfold all day. it takes me back to my own time at the justice department when we were really struggling to coordinate our events and operations in the u.s. and
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overseas quite frankl. it is about effective communication. i left the justice department specifically to start a small business with my colleagues and the objective was to utilize the collection of data verses foist based information with rapid analysis yet we are facing us a dilemma today that we have talked about this in the past while we are getting better at creating reliable s -- networks but now we see terrorist organizations utilizing the same technology to coordinate their attacks. and to detonate bombs. neil: we don't know if that have been here but don't mind my ignorance that the fact the mayor or the
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governor or local law enforcement officials that they did not shut down so phone service as mayor bloomberg did and tunnels and bridges will pass 9/11. that was not done here. and authorities did not make it necessary bets tha they were not sold on activated or pardon my terminate -- terminology. >> or the policy was not clear and things were happening so fast we just did not know if we should turn them off or not. neil: is said that the better part of valor? >> i agree. another reason now is there are other forms of
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technology and communication that we can use to support our first responders and don't need to have the networks to coordinate first responder activity we have satellite communications for years with the law enforcement community down in the cambridge area so this hits home for me. was on the of bone trying to get family but remembering at the same time how far we have ce to develop the use of satellite communication to transmit data with quick focused it said data and the s sandy than mapping so first responders could react but ultimately led these
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explosive devices were detonated using cellular phones and underscores the importance of staying ahead to respond to these disasters. even to turn off cellular devices people still recording with there iphone. neil: that is true. that could come in later. we don't want to discourage people from using there i phone but to support the process of developing a network and how the chief of police in cambridge we have been working with him for years on a pilot program specifically for mobile devices and local civilians
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in the process of collecting data for community policing but in disasters like this so they can work with the police much more effectively neil: date you for your expertise. and peter barnes said washington waiting from national officials. >> we just got a statement from one of the top bosses in washington the secretary of homeland security agenda paul lozano says'' match our thoughts and prayers go out to everyone impacted escially the families of the above one's injured. federal-state local agencies continue to respond and that the president's direction to provide any support necessary and we encourage the public to be vigilant
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and listen to lew direction from officials. >> and with an incident like this and now that you bring it up by have not seen those color codes after 9/11 there were five. yellow, orange, i don't think we ever got below yellow. i think peopleot desensitize. but i will follow up on that. neil: manor futures markets are retively contained an don't mean anything and once they open from tokyo to
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singapore of those are down off the lows and they have a lot more trading juju. what you suspect to see? >> there was a lot more volatility coming this morning for opening of trading. ec the volatility index was news of these explosions happened in boston. and a better way to look at is the uncertainty index. is this a terrorist atta and we will see what the news reports say. but the key is to state called.
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-- is tuesday called and follow your plans and move forward. what the terrorists once for them to lose is to not be in fear. go to work and kiss your wife thank roadwork and be an american and let's move forward to get this economy going. neil: to be simplistic i am pretty good at that we tend to sell off more when the threats is international terrorist based and an american like terry nichols. not as a general rule of thumb or to justify one brand over another a bad guy is a bad guy but we tend to
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get anxious that they brought this to the point* despite the billions are trillions to stop them. >> right to. and you will never be 100 percent safe you just have to remember that is the odds. we will never be part of a terrorist incident to remember that first thing but secd there will be a lot of volatility in the morning but the markets could end up higher and they don't seem to have common sense. look at north korea they are going crazy with their young leader if everybody worried about a nuclear missile but gold is still going down that is what you'd be buying but then people say i don't
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want to buy gold if it is the end of the world because it is hard to each. [laughter] neil: but where they are placing their money is treasury bonds. at 200 -- to 58:00 p.m. when the stock market fell through the floor at that exact moment the 10 year treasurys were hitting close to all-time lows. so despite the anemic yield is the safest investment. do you see that continuing to plan out and the flight to quality is not like gold for hard assets but something as mundane as a treasury note? >> flight to quality, a flight to safety was this the last gasp of the 30 year bull market?
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is it? we had a 30 year bull market they yields have kept going lower and lower and we set an all-time high. the same thing with gold with the of bull run and people forget that gold started to sell off august august 2011. lee has been in a two-year selloffs but everybody finally woke up that has been almost two years now. welcome to the party. the first thing you want to do what ever comes to your mind in the morning don't do is sit down and have another cup of coffee and relax. what you want to do first is wrong because it will be tempered by fear and even
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ocean. >> you want to have a cool mind that you may not want to sell off assets but i don't know what tomorrow will bring but the sun will rise in the east and set in the west. neil: hope. i know lot of you tune in to hear the discussion with the of fatalities that and now better than 130 injured but we also have to put this into the global context how this is put in place and that is understanding how the world sizes it up and to trade on it they are a reflection of the world's anxiety or lack thereof and that things are getting very
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tough that is reflected in market trading and their concernslife-and-death security is a premier issue than that is germane. if that supersedes north korea so be it. that's the is what we follow. not even our own futures markets that seem tame but those from wha volins can reap. that is why we do it and follow it to give you the world. my next guest michael we are waiting to hear from your colleagues and friends and othersuthat i am sure will be a huge joint press coerence but how are they coordinating not to give away professional secrets but how did their work together? >> secure the scene.
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it is a huge steam and as so often happens the reports contdict like the jfk library was bombed and it wasn't the other devices were found. neil: even disputed reports it was not an explosion but the bomb by see your point*. >> they get the victims out taking care of peop who are injured and try to reunite people have been lost but also find out who lose there. someone sets off a device they watch. neil: dow jones is reporting 51 detonated devices besides the two that went off.
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can one guy pull thaff? >> from the experience we have had it is unlikely so it is likely they are getting help weather assembling, planting, avoid detection. neil: but that person would be picked up on likely one of these cameras. >> you certainly hope so. neil: what to look for? >> you take all of the seeds that you can and that cannot -- what happens during the blasters see the person running and had a drop maybe not a blast as much as shrapnel. because your body is thrown in the opposite direction. is anti-personnel device at of the playbook of the middle east they want to rt people. neil: can americans do that?
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could a terry nichols type? >> you hope not but it we recently witnessed horrific acts within newtown shooting with depraved situation. neil: but they will not all use their hands? >> no. d officials are also asmbling by the microphone we will go to them right now >> i will make a couple of comments then turn it over to the special agent in charge of the fbi office here and then ask commissioner davis to make comments and we're happy to take questions that you may have. as you all know this whole community has been dealing with a horrific event today, two explosions near the finish line of today's
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boston marathon. over 100 people injured, some avely, we are not ready yet to confirm the details of those injuries. federal, state, and local law enforcement on scene and coordinating very closely. the fbi has taken charge. and the special agent in charge will speaker to that in just ainute. it is an active investigation particularly in the several blocks around the blast area. that is a crime scene. the national guard hasas secured that crime scene and is limiting access to it. not just this evening but the next day or two while the investigation continues. the support center has been opened at the park plaza castle on columbus avenue and there were several
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runners who were unable to finish the race because the race was stopped right after the bench. there are buses bringin those runners from various cities and towns to the support station now. and families who have not had a chance yet t connect our friends and supporters or who have other needs and check-in at the support center. the mayor and his staff have made staff available to meet people's needs. otherwise the city of boston is open and will be open tomorrow but not business as usual. high into law enforcement presence with the sincerity and seriousness of the ongoing invesgation. people should expect those who are writing data key
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there will be random checks of backpacks and parcels and just be patient for the time being it is f the public's safety. also everyone be on heightened vigilance. that is required of everyone please report suspicious packages or parcels or activity to local law-enforcement. there have been a number of stories i have heard this afternoon of residents in boston and along the route to that the marathon passes through of extraordinary kindness shown to runners and others and visitors and neighbors who are as shaken by this experience as we are. we so appreciate those kindnessnd thank you for them. we will get throh this. we don't have all the answers to all of your
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questions for it here in the media or around the commonwealth or the country or the world. but i can tell you from the president to t members of our congressional delegation to many fellow governors who have called to check and an all leaders of law-enforcement here in this day and at the local and federal level we are coming together to get to the bottom of this. i will turn over the podium to the specialagent in charge. >> thank you very much governor patrick. the most important fact i want to convey has already been mentioned, the fbi is taking the lead in this investigation asserting federal jurisdiction through the joint terrorism task force which is comprised by all members of the law enforcement agencies. this is a combined federal-state local effort
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and an ongoing investigati , a criminal investigation that has the potential terrorist investigation. we're working diligently to gather information and gather all the facts to bring those were responsible to justice as soon as ssible. it is an ongoing investigation as governor patrick mentioned. i am not at liberty right now to go into details but i encourage everyone to have a heightened state of vigilance tonight and tomorrow going forward. if anybody has any information to this crime please call when 800 -- 800-call-fbi we're bringing substantial federal resources such as the boston
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atf office of the law enforcement agencies will bring tremendous reurces to bear there will be brought appear to the boston area. that being said i will now turn over to the u.s. attorney or tease then commissioner davis. >> speenine good evening i just want to echo what the governor has said and what many others have said throughout the day to day that this is a horrific tragedy in our city of boston and the on behalf of the department of justice at is here to provide the resources necessary for this investigation. there are a lot of questions that we wi we could answer at this point* but what i can assure you is this is a thorough and active and fluent ongoing investigation that but and i ask that you help with that.
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the is a lot of information and some misinformation we do not want t add to that and we want to continue to investigate this manner then get to the individuals that may be responsible and the department of justice is prepared to and provide assistance necessary sir atf and other federal agencies and state and local partners as well. i just wanted to echo a -- ago that. thank you. >>. >> on behalf of the mayor i'd like to offer my sympathies to the victims of the families of this horrendous event. this cowardly act will not be taken, in stride we will
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rn over every rock. i am working closely with my partner and boston police department is on the scene. a horrendous loss of life and at least three people have died but the number of injuries and the people at issue right now we will not have hard figures until tomorrow morning. there were all sorts of questions being asked. but there is no suspect. there are people that we are talking to but there is no suspect as has been widely reported in th press. i would like to fix that right now. there will be questions that you have been we will do our best but this is still very early in the investigation. tomoow willot be business as usual the boston police department is on the
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emergency deployment working 12 hour shifts with the significant police presence throughout the city. please give space around the area as a process the scene. if there are any pieces of the information,hotos from the incident getting back to the fbi to plan there in charge of the investigation because of the nature as well as the boston police line now i will invite the district attorney did say some words. >> earlier this afternoon but so many bostonian die was near the finish line and left 30 minutes before this occurred and a short time ago our top staff went down to the scene. it was a large and disturbing scene.
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like each of you i am praying for the victims and their loved ones. it is a terrible terrible day for them. they and the public at large can count on our best and seamless work in the days to come. seconds after the bombs of civians are helping the victims along members of the boston police department and ems. the hours that followed police and medical psonnel sent dozens or hundreds of volunteers to help. that is what americans do in times of crisis. become together and help o another. moments like these, a terrible as they are don't show our weakness better strength. thank you. >> we will take questions trend 12.
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>> no. next question spinet is there a person of interest >> i will not comme on its pacific investigative needs right now i am not at liberty but there is investigative activity going on but i am not at liberty to comment on the specifics. is a very fluid and active investigation of our resources are being brought to bear. again and will not comment on specifics with a number of explosivefound at the location. i will not comment evividence analysis is ongoing right now and it would be imprudent for me to comment
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before that is finished trend 12 >> in the area that is the kinds -- crime scene from berkeley then north and south tountington that is a secure area right now. that may get smaller but that area will not be accessible for normal traffic people in hotels and to live there that have to work out how they get to and from where they need to be but otherwise it is fair to say that area will be locked down until the investigation is over. some of it has to be sorted out but it will not be easy
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simple or regular and in most cases people cannot have access to that specific area a it evolves over the course of the night. >> [inaudible] >> exactly. in this sense it is like the storms that we will have to depend on you. soon as we get permission we will put that out and count on you to get out to the general public. >> are you confident people are safe now? >> we're in the process of going through all of the abandoned property that was discarded and we have pretty much clear the wilson street area. there are no further devices at this point* in time but we are getting reports from various places about suppositious -- suspicious
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packages. i am not at liberty to say we are at ease but pursuing every leadthat we have. >> can you confirm the a year-old child was killed? >> we will have the information in the morning people are compiling as we speak. neil: we're continuing to monitor a the press conference but a couple of details the death count is up to three and a debate whether the possible culprit was that brigham women's hospital but officials say that is simpl not the case. there are interested parties they are talking to but not a suspect in any one of those hospitals and f

Lou Dobbs Tonight
FOX Business April 15, 2013 10:00pm-11:00pm EDT

News/Business. Lou Dobbs. The journalist offers his take on issues and interviews newsmakers. (CC)

TOPIC FREQUENCY Boston 29, Us 8, Fbi 7, U.s. 4, Washington 3, North Korea 3, Patrick 2, Terry Nichols 2, Peter Barnes 2, Davis 2, Cambridge 2, Massachusetts 2, Madrid 2, London 2, China 2, Hasas 1, Ainute 1, Frankl 1, Sandy 1, Paul Lozano 1
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